From Silent Agreements to Shared Intentions: Revealing the Patterns That Shape Families

Well, welcome everyone. Thank you for joining us, for silent agreements, shared intentions, revealing the patterns that shape families. My name is Corey Ganyan. I’m a senior wealth advisor at Beacon family office at CI Asante Wealth Management limited and I work alongside successful families as they navigate the complexities of wealth, business and leadership transitions, helping them align vision, values and legacy with clarity and purpose. I’m excited to have you join us today for what’s going to be another fantastic conversation.

0:41
Legacy builders live is produced by Beacon family office at Cai Asante, where we support successful families to design integrated strategies for their wealth, business and legacy through a values first, planning and intentional stewardship approach. We support enterprising families in creating successful successors and securing multi generational peace of mind. This webcast extends that mission, bringing together forward thinking leaders and proven frameworks to help families and their advisors lead with clarity, confidence and purpose across generations. Now if you have any questions during today’s session, please feel free to drop them in the Q and A box, and if time permits, we’ll address a few questions live, and if not, we’ll follow up afterwards with you one on one.

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And before we begin, a quick note, our content shared during this webcast is intended for informational and educational purposes only. Does not constitute professional advice of any kind, and the views and opinions expressed by our panelists are their own and do not necessarily reflect the views or positions of the organizations they’re affiliated with. We encourage viewers to consult with qualified professionals regarding their own specific circumstances.

2:10
Now introducing today’s panelists. First, Steve Legler is an advisor at Blackwood family enterprise services, supporting enterprising families through the relational challenges of wealth ownership and transition, drawing from experience from his own business, family and family office work. And he’s also the author of two books, shift your family business and interdependent wealth. He helps families clarify roles and strengthen how they work together across generations. Welcome Steve, thank you. Corey, good to be here and Dave.

And Dave speck is the founder and president of advising generations LLC and a longtime advocate for family owned businesses and advisors who serve them. He’s the author of the family business, whisperer and an educator who helps families and professionals understand the dynamic that shape generational decision making and enterprise longevity. Welcome Dave.

1:39
Good to be here. Corey, thanks for the invite

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during today’s webcast, our goal is to explore five key questions about what we’re calling silent agreements and how they shape families behavior, how habits control and control can limit contribution, and how conversation and learning can help families move towards greater clarity shared intent and healthier ways of working together over time.

2:10
Now let’s dive into our first question.

2:15
How do the same patterns help showing up in families even when circumstances change.

2:25
Now, often I hear families say we’ve dealt with this before. So why does this keep coming back? And from an advisor’s perspective, that question usually points to something deeper than the issue at hand, decisions, roles and expectations tend to follow familiar paths shaped by history and habit, even when the family grows and Steve, when you’re working with families, What patterns do you see forming quietly around authority, responsibility or contribution that families may not immediately recognize.

3:10
Good question. The biggest difference I often see is the speed at which the different members of the family are accepting change, and so you might have the senior members of a family that are entrenched in leadership roles where they’ve always been the ones deciding, and they tend to look at their offspring, the next generation, as kind of frozen in time at a younger age where they don’t have the ability. So that pattern of I decide you do what I say can extend way further into the future than that is really, realistically necessary, and so that having the older generation have that moment where it clicked in their head that not only should they be downloading some of the decision making to the others, but that they really, they kind of have to do it, and it’s it is the next step. But somehow, for some people, allowing or delegating some of that those decisions downstream is kind of an admission that maybe they’ve lost their fastball. And so they, some of them, will go kicking and screaming before they will allow others to have the room. And so you have the younger people who want more and can take on more, but they aren’t necessarily given the space to take on bigger roles and to grow into bigger leadership positions.

4:50
I like that phrase lost their fastball. That’s a good one. Steve, Dave,

4:56
when families bring you a specific challenge, what helps you look beyond the surface issue to understand what’s really shaping how decisions are being made.

5:10
Well, one of the first things that I have to do when I’m showing up to a family is is show up kind of with a beginner’s mind and and not reflect on what I’m doing with other families, because as I think about approaches that others have taken, oftentimes those can actually stand in the way of the creativity that a family will need. So beginning with a curiosity and with an open mind as to what families can need, what processes can work for them, I will often ask questions, you know, how, how has this been addressed in the past? Or what pattern? What pattern is there in your family currently for navigating something like this, whether in this generation or the generation before, you know, and so having them reflect on on their own patterns and then name their own patterns, can then open up an opportunity for me to ask if they would be open to to a pattern interrupt and to alternatives, as To, you know, the path forward.

6:20
Dave, any comments?

6:24
What? What Dave mentioned there, I like what he said about, you know, inviting them to people. Would you like to try to interrupt that and and it made me think about the way we do this. Work with families. We do spend time where it’s us and a bunch of family members, but we also normally spend some one on one time.

6:46
Sometimes there are certain things that are addressable, or more easily addressed, in the one on ones and then brought to the family meeting to do it in a group setting. So there’s, there’s just some importance of Yes, showing up with a beginner’s mind, but also making sure that you’re creating the safe space for the one on one conversations before you bring them to the to the bigger group. Yeah, one thing I would add to that Steve is, is oftentimes, I’ll ask permission before asking the really hard question. And often those are happening in the one on ones, where it’s look, when we get to this point in the family meeting, there’s, I need your voice here. And can I can I lean on you to ask you this question? And are you open to sharing what you really feel? So a lot of it is in the pre work, like you said, Steve, in those one on ones, laying the groundwork, seeing what they’re comfortable talking about, and even role playing. How would you describe what you’re going to what you’re going to say in this part, and making sure that they’re comfortable and that they and that it can, it can land. Well, I think families, no family likes surprises, especially in family meetings, and so it is. It is the pre work that helps remove as much anxiety in those family interactions, especially when there are strong patterns that need to be interrupted, like you’re.

8:11
asking for permission, right? And sort of role playing it. Because I often say that much of what we’re doing in this work with families is helping them have the conversations that they know they need to have. They’re just not able to do them or to have those conversations left to themselves. So really, what we are doing is coaching and facilitating, having these conversations, and if they were easy, conversations that they wouldn’t need us. So yeah, we can do to help them prepare, to help them feel ready, to get the confidence and the courage to address these subjects that without us there, they might not be able to even go down that road. That’s all part of the work that we’re doing.

8:55
I appreciate that one, Steven. You know, as Dave said, we’ve we’re giving that autonomy to the to the family. We’re not taking that away by facilitating, as well as as a coach, holding them capable, like, as you both mentioned, they the family members, know that this isn’t serving them. They know that something needs to be done, and so to be able to help facilitate that, that individual growth in in service of the greater system. Sure, sure can, can help.

9:39
And in the end, it’s it’s their family, it’s their family meeting. We’re asked to participate and facilitate, but ultimately, we need, we need to keep it all of their issues and their agenda at the center of the table, and we just need to be in service. And I think sometimes, as advisors, we can kind of get in the way of some of that and whatever answers they come up with by the family, for the family are going to be better than any solutions we could invent or borrow from the Jones family that we met with two weeks ago. Exactly yes.

10:15
Now, moving on to our next question. What happens when families realize they’re operating on assumptions that were never clearly discussed and in our work, those those moments of confusion or tension often point to exactly what those assumptions are that were developed over time. And, you know, I find that it can be things like loyalty, fairness, responsibility, and you know, even though they weren’t explicitly agreed to, somehow the system operates and morphs to accept them in some way, until there’s some disruptions and they don’t serve.

11:10
And so Dave coming to you first on this one, how do you help families surface these assumptions in a way that supports understanding, rather than defensiveness.

11:25
Well, I’ll go back to what Steve said earlier. A lot of the groundwork is laid in the individual interactions. So allowing allowing individual family members to have space to talk about the assumptions and to ask them, Where did those assumptions come from? What are those based on? Were those explicit or were those implied? And oftentimes it’s in those one on one interactions that they can unpack, they can gain a comfort level with actually, I just made that up. I don’t know that. I was never told that, and for them to be able to verbalize that brings a level of humility Into what then will be the family meeting space for us to be able to address there’s been assumptions made. Some of these assumptions have been based on communication. Others of these assumptions have been made based on the lack of knowledge. And so what can we do to close the gap between our expectations and reality. So again, I’m a big fan of doing that pre work with the one on ones, gaining the confidence of the individual family members, allowing them to have a voice and to not have to worry about, you know, kind of where they fall in the family dynamic, whether they’re younger or older, or the loud one or the quiet one or the peacemaker. In those one on ones, they can just be who they are. We can ask them great questions. We can encourage them, and we can also challenge them in one on one settings where it wouldn’t be appropriate in the family setting. So again, I’m a huge fan of the the one on one work.

13:02
But again, it goes back to, am I genuinely curious about them? Do I genuinely care for their well being and what they’re trying to accomplish? And then, am I courageous enough as an advisor to ask them hard questions?

13:18
Yeah,

13:22
Steve, I’m going to come to you, and then there’s a few things that I want to come back on that that Dave mentioned there, Steve, if a family starts to become aware of these unspoken agreements, what shifts Do you notice in how they understand the roles, expectations or authority,

13:47
the the kinds of assumptions that that I see often are often that the older generation will assume that the younger generation because, well, we raised them this way, they they believe all The same things that we do in terms of work ethic and responsibility and putting in the 80 hour weeks, which, which, generally are not always there in the in the younger generation, especially these days, and so ideas about work life balance, which, which might send the older generation into like, Oh My God, you know, what is this? I have to get up at five. And, you know, this happens in all kinds of families, and it is never discussed. And just having the opportunity to talk about it, first one on one, and then as a group, to to normalize for these families that, yeah, it was the same with me and my dad, and it’s the same all over the place, to just let them know that this is not they’re not the only family going through this, but that just having the opportunity to address the questions of the assumptions and Having a discussion around it. They’re already miles ahead of most families that will just continue to leave these things as never discussed. So giving them the opportunity to talk about it, not to shame them, to be to be humble with them, and talk about how, yeah, this is normal, and it’s good that we’re talking about it, because now at least we can make some progress, or you have one thing to add before you move on.

15:26
You know, I think asking families about the roles that they play in the business and asking them for, you know, do they have a defined role? Most family members that I meet don’t have clear job descriptions, and oftentimes don’t get direct feedback on how they’re performing. And while this may seem like a benefit for the rising generation to maybe skip on the skip on the, you know, the end of year, you know, meeting, it’s actually terrible for them, because they don’t know. Am I performing? Am I not? They’re held to a higher standard than non family employees, but if they don’t get feedback on how they’re performing, then they don’t they don’t actually know, and it can be really tough on them and their development. And then the other one is, is just for me, I like to call out the informality as families, we typically, we typically lean towards informal because we’re family. And at some point in family enterprises, the informality stops working. And we just need to call it that the informality worked for us for a long time, and now there’s just too many of us. There’s too many things that there’s too many, you know, shared roles we have, and we just need to lean on more formality. And most families hate formality. But ultimately, when you get from generation to generation, you need to start incorporating formality so that people understand what you know, what they’re responsible for.

17:00
Those those performance evaluations, you made me flashback more than half my life ago. The most awkward 15 minutes of the year was when my dad would sit me down and try to give me some sort of performance review. It was nice later on when, when we had somebody between him and I to do that. And although that was still a bit awkward, but, but we can all benefit from the feedback, and if it’s done properly, it’s very helpful. And too often in family businesses, there’s not enough of it.

17:31
Absolutely, that’s, that’d be a great. Other discussion is our relationship with feedback. I don’t know if we won’t go there today, but I think that that’s that’s such a good one. And, yeah, kindness in clarity, you know, having having defined roles, having scorecards, things that people can actually measure themselves against, so they know if they’re doing a good job before somebody else tells them

18:01
is, is great. Dave, you mentioned the one on one discussions, and you know, the three of us all do this, this work.

18:15
I’m curious, for each of you, what does it mean for a family member to show up to those one on ones ready, prepared to get the most out of that work that you do with them.

18:35
Well, I feel like we as advisors have to take responsibility for helping them show up that way. So I never want to surprise a client. So even in our one on ones, preemptively, I’m going to send them some questions. Hey, these are some these are some areas I would like to explore. I’d love for you to have a chance to think about them beforehand, so that you can be comfortable and we can have a great conversation. So again, there’s even pre work to the to the one on ones that needs to happen, so that you can make great use of the one on one time. And also you need to know the personalities that you’re dealing with, because some are like Steve, and can react and be fine on the fly and are comfortable just going with it. And there’s others that want and require more time to process their thoughts, their feelings and and they may even have to take notes and bring those notes to the meeting so that they can, you know, convey what they feel. And so I think it’s unfair if we think that everyone is like Steve and can just show up and and move along with the conversation. So again, it’s about pre work.

19:43
Well that, you know, that’s a good segue to me. You’re right. They’re not, they’re not the same and different family members once we get to know them and we can relate to them in ways they like to be related to. I tried not to give extra homework to people who I already sense are not that engaged. I try to keep the one on ones very loose, and it’s just a check in. And how did that last meeting go for you? And and very informal, but there are some times when we’re preparing for for something at an upcoming meeting where they need to do some homework, but I will always be prefacing it or sending them an email and like, please that before we we speak again next week. I hope you’ll have a chance to review this and be prepared to discuss it.

20:35
But I never want to be someone who’s giving them more homework, because one thing that some people don’t recognize that is a challenge for us in some of these families where we’re working with is they are in a very busy part of their lives, raising kids, and, you know, kids doing homework after after dinner, and finding the time even like you can’t do all these interviews from nine to five, Monday to Friday. Some of them have to be on weekends and evenings and so always recognizing that we are perhaps impinging on some other family time and not abusing that, and recognizing the flexibility that they are showing and we are showing to keep them to want to keep coming and being engaged and being able to have them relate to us as a relatable person who’s there for them, not for their parents, but for them, to help them have their voice heard In the in the family meetings, is is something you never, you can never really, you can’t forget that.

21:48
No, I think that’s a good, good reminder. And even as we think of you know what it takes to do this work with facilitators and coaches and you know, it’s a big investment in time and energy, not just financial resources, to move the family forward with this work.

22:16
Moving on to our next question here, how do families move from patterns of control towards shared contribution over time. And Steve mentioned this a little bit of, you know, as we grow up and and not just seeing somebody as the way they were, or, you know, just because we, we raised them this way, and so, you know, I, I’ve seen this in my work where, you know, there’s family members start to notice that, you Know that responsibility and authority is becoming unsettled, and you know, people carry more of that, that decision making weight where others are on the sidelines. And there’s this recognition that that contribution is is uneven, but that responsibility maybe is desired, and some of the decision making, as well as the family evolves, changes and grows up. And so Steve, when you begin to work with families, and they look at these dynamics more closely. What shifts do you see in how roles or authority start to take shape?

23:50
You use the word a minute or so ago evolve? And I really think that these changes within a family system, don’t happen quickly, and we have to normalize the fact for them that it’s it takes a while before some of these things start to move and then start to stick. And so if you have an expectation that we’re going to go and say, Okay, from now on, we want, you know, Bobby and Susie to take over this and be in charge of it.

24:29
If we expect that that’s going to happen at the next meeting, we’re probably setting ourselves up for for disappointment. And so just having the people recognize that slow changes and that often the same people who are lamenting the fact that they don’t have a voice when you try to put out a call for who wants to step up and do something, they’re they’re not necessarily recognizing that. That’s a message for them. Now we I always talk about how in most families, when we cut people like us come in, we’re dealing with what was more or less an autocratic decision making system, and we’re trying to move it towards a more democratic but that takes months and months and quarters and years before It happens. And so you have to look for every little opportunity where somebody has a desire for change and somebody’s willing to let something go and just take those small wins wherever you can. Because if you have an expectation that this is going to go quickly and that you’re just going to make some pronouncement and everything is going to change, it really doesn’t happen that way very often.

25:47
Dave, what? What do you find helps families expand contribution while still maintaining clarity, trust and direction?

26:02
I do think it starts at the top. So whoever’s leading the organization kind of sets the tone for control or delegation. And I have had to lovingly challenge founders about this dichotomy of continuity versus control. So they’ll come and they’ll they’ll engage me because they say they want continuity in the business, but their actions will likely be modeled after control behavior. And so oftentimes I have to, I have to ask them, Do you want continuity or do you want control? Because ultimately, you can’t have both forever and so again, that takes a relationship to ask a hard question. But if you truly want continuity, at some point, you have to begin to let go of some control, I would say, from the perspective of the rising generation, many of them are pursuing rights and not necessarily responsibilities, and so if we can help them to change their mindset around you know, what do you what is it about More that you want in terms of contribution, do you do you want a title? Do you want a bigger title? Do you want more compensation? Or do you really want a bigger responsibility? If you want more responsibility, there’s usually opportunities for that. And founders that are busy likely have parts and pieces of their jobs that they don’t like to do and are typically not good at, that can be taken over by someone that is willing to take on responsibility. So I think it’s a bit of a mindset shift from from the rising generation to seek responsibility rather than trying to necessarily grasp control, and then from a senior generation perspective, understanding that there’s always going to be healthy tension between this desire for continuity with the natural inclination to control something.

28:18
I like your rights. They’re they’re trying to have the, you know, it’s my right to have this, as opposed to, there’s an opportunity for me to take on some responsibility. And often, you know, each one is waiting for the other side to go first, right? And so, so if, and that’s where we in our one on ones can sort of normalize that and encourage each one of them to move an inch towards the other one at the same time. And then each one will hopefully perceive some movement from the other side. And then, once we get over that inertia, and there’s desire from both directions to have, okay, let’s see if we can move this in a better direction, then we can start to make progress. But if that subtle shift in attitude towards this is my right, I’m demanding this, as opposed to here’s a place where I can show some goodwill and moving in a direction to take something off someone else’s plate so I can show that I’m good at this, and at the same time, relieve them of a responsibility that they don’t like.

29:34
Let’s, let’s help these families find those little win wins, and once we start moving, the evolution can proceed, but as long as we’re baked in and everyone’s dug in, we’re not going to move very far. Corey, I have one other addition there.

29:52
Language matters. So I think as advisors, a lot of the work that we need to do is helping them with their language and how they speak to each other. Yeah, so, you know how a rising Gen talks to a senior generation matter? You know, it’s, it’s, it’s complete. It’s completely correlated with how that’s going to land on on them. And so again, going back to that individual work, some of that coaching work, language matters. You know, if it’s a rising Gen that is genuinely curious, that wants more responsibility, that wants to honor the legacy of their parents, that wants to shoulder some burden, if we can give them the proper language and help them practice what that what that would sound like, then it will be, it will likely be received in a much better way. But we can’t assume that they have that language. We have to, we have to work with them on it. And again, we may need, may need to have a pattern interrupt if, if there’s, if there is a pattern of of speaking in a way that you know doesn’t land well between the generations and just way they speak to each other too, right? You’re making me think of a rising Gen person in a one on one says something to me, and I’ll say, well, that’s great, and I love the way you said it. So frankly to me, do you think if you said it in the same way to your dad, it would land the same way?

31:21
Okay, so maybe we should take some time to think about a way that you can verbalize this, in a way that recognizes his expectation, and practice saying it in a way that you think, that you know, let him and if we have to work through a few iterations of it till, till we get the words just right. It’s probably worth doing this, because your chances of success will go up markedly. Yeah, absolutely. I, I want to go back to that, the gap between, well, you know what I offered this before, and they never took me up on it. So why am I going to try that again?

32:03
And I think oftentimes we see that in relationships where both sides can feel that if this has been going on for a long time, and yeah, language is a key in it is if you offer it the same way you did before, might not land again. And so what can we do to to make the same offer, maybe, and deliver it in a way that resonates with that other person?

32:34
Sometimes they don’t hear each other and will the person will typically blame the other person for not delivering the message properly, but it there’s there’s two sides to the communication, and sometimes we assume that what we’ve said has been understood. And quite often, that’s not what has my favorite expression about communication is now,

33:03
now I’m losing it. It’s a George Bernard Shaw. The biggest problem with this communication is the illusion that it has taken. So you said something. And I mean, this happens with my wife all the time. I’ll say something, and you know, then I’ll say, Did you hear me? No, oh yeah. I had to make sure, because otherwise that I’m assuming she heard me, she’s assuming I never said it. And here we go again. So just part of the role of a facilitator is to make sure that the communication has been delivered in the best way possible, but that it’s also been received and that there’s common understanding around things, absolutely yes. And I’m sure your wife says things every once in a while that you don’t hear too, Right? Steve, oh yeah, good. All right.

33:55
All right, moving us on, really, in the spirit of sustainability. So making a shift is one thing. What helps families stay aligned when new pressures arise.

34:09
And, you know, we can, can talk about beginning to share those responsibilities differently, opening up contributions. And then there becomes that challenge of sustaining the change. And you know, circumstances evolve. Could be the leadership transitions, liquidity events, personal milestones, and they all test how steady those new ways of working together really are and so Dave from your perspective,

34:48
when familiar patterns start to reappear, what helps families realign clarity and trust without slipping back into those old habits? Do so I find that when families develop plans together, not necessarily that everyone has a vote, but if everyone has a voice, then it can be there, it can be our plan, and then it can be revisited as our plan. It can be revisited as my understanding of our, our, you know, path forward was this, you know, what, what changed, or something like that. Where I find the biggest challenges is when there is a plan that’s created by a person, and then the plan is, you know, it’s basically like something is people are being acted upon, rather than than acting together. And so as early as I can, I’m trying to get founders to at least engage the voice of spouse, of rising Jen, to have voice. And then as plans get put in place, you know, then then they can say, this is this is ours. The other thing I would say is that we have to often remind people that they all have agency. And sometimes the biggest frustration is, you know, my dad is doing this, or my my mom won’t let me do that, and people feel trapped, but I think it’s important that we go back to their agency. And what choices do you have? Now, some people don’t realize that you actually are choosing to work in the failing business, and by choosing it, you may be choosing, you know, a situation that offers you less control of a specific situation. But I think oftentimes, too many people forget that they’re still agents that they can take action and that they aren’t just being acted upon.

36:57
I like that accountability piece. The it’s our plan, not my plan, not your plan. We’ve done this together, and so we’re accountable to a collective on this. That’s a good one to anchor on. Steve, when families begin operating differently, what seems to support those changes as the family continues to grow and adapt,

37:26
I jotted down the word CRO chief repetition officer. People have to be reminded of things over and over, and that is a role that we as a facilitator can play to normalize it, and then hopefully we get family members to also start to repeat the things we decided we weren’t going to do that this way anymore, and that from now on, that we would decide these things this way and to just get them into recognizing and admitting and sharing amongst themselves what they have agreed to together. But it all, it’s all predicated on what Dave was saying, that it actually is something that they developed and CO created together, and that not, this is not something that came on the stone tablets from from, from the mountain. And so it needs to be.

38:28
We need to make sure, when we are helping families co create new realities, that they are all nodding their heads so that we can go back later when things don’t sort of land with the way we thought it was agreed to. And we can ask the question, well, wait a second. I remember at our last meeting, I think I thought we decided this, Did something change, or did I misunderstand it? We can. We can be the dumb guy with the stupid question to give other people the space to jump in and sort of readjust, and where are we and and it doesn’t. And maybe, maybe what we thought we agreed to was sub optimal, and maybe we found a way to do it even better. Wouldn’t that be great? Or, if not, who do we have to remind about the fact that, yeah, we all thought we agreed to this, and so maybe you didn’t understand, but there’s a role for you to play here, to step up going forward, I’ll give you a concrete example, Corey family right now that we worked with last year to put together a shared use policy for vacation homes, so how they would be scheduled, How maintenance would take place, you know, if things got broken, like how that would, how those things would be taken care of. And so at the end of the meeting, when, when we kind of solidified what the agreement was, you know, these aren’t legal agreements, but you can take a step as a family to say, hey, at the end of the meeting, everyone, just come over and put your put your initials on this, and let’s decide together. This is, this is what we’ve decided on together, so that when, when something happens in a way that’s not decided upon, that that we have something that we agreed on, and that we can hold each other accountable in a positive way. And so that can happen with shared use agreements that can happen with, I mean, there was an aviation policy one family put together with, you know, how they would access the plane and how they would use it, how many hours and how that would get scheduled. And so I think again, families often fight formality, but when they can decide on something together, when the advisors will document it for them, give them, give them a place to go and find those things they agreed upon.

40:48
And then also, you know, hold them accountable and repeat, like Steve said, to just remind especially when you know things aren’t in question. Hey, let’s just take five minutes, you know, as part of this next one, and review what we decided on last year together in terms of how we’d be in in shared ownership or shared use of these specific assets.

41:11
Yeah. And what a great example of that informality and and the need to to grow, grow into some formality because it’s, it’s no longer serving and, you know, I, I can reference a lot of a lot of times where I’ve rented Airbnb or VRBO, and they take a damage deposit, and there’s a whole bunch of policies there. And, you know, you gotta respect the place. And what’s the difference between the the family’s property and somebody else’s Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely.

41:57
And moving on to our next question, which conversations help families shift from long standing habits toward shared intent?

42:13
And you know those, those that recognition I find of of the patterns, and we’ve talked about this a few times throughout our hour already. You know, some of those serve service well and some don’t. And so it really becomes the act of adjusting how those decisions and responsibilities are shared, and you know that that slight shift of attention, and I think that’s that’s really kind of what we we’ve talked about so far now, Steve, which conversations tend to bring the most clarity or forward movement when patterns and expectations are being re examined, you’re making me flash back to a family meeting I was in a few years ago where the parents who were in their 60s were kind of getting fed up with taking care of certain things around the family vacation home, and the way the mother kind of threw it out there in kind of a Hey guys, can you help me out? I really, I really can’t do all of this anymore. And seeing how all the rising Jen sort of just saw this as, oh my god, it’s real. It’s and it wasn’t. It wasn’t done in admonishing them for not doing enough. It was really kind of a, not quite a cry for help, but just somehow in the attitude that it’s being presented in a different way, and it’s being presented as a genuine need. And so if it’s done kind of more as a request, as opposed to an order, if it’s, Hey, please help me out. I really need somebody to step up, as opposed to, you know, I keep doing this, and you guys don’t, you know, it’s the attitude that usually I’m thinking the older generation exhibits a new attitude, but it can come from the younger Generation too, and just somehow a different reality of how how genuine something is and how personal you’re feeling, it can somehow land differently, better than if it’s the same old complaint being voiced again, and then people just tune in.

45:00
So somehow, just the the approach and the tone and kind of, hey, can you help me please, as opposed to the finger wag,

45:12
amazing how we hear that request for help so much differently. And I think what you also said there, Steve, is that struck me. I struck me was, you know, asking a group versus having those individual questions. And you know, we haven’t talked about triangulation, and that’s not really our topic, but how much that going to the family as a whole and requesting it of everybody versus having individual conversations, and how maybe that can serve us better in that that approach, Dave looking across your work, which conversations make the greatest difference when they happen earlier, rather than later.

46:09
I love to live at the intersection of the past and the future, and inviting families to live there as well is fun. So we’ll take one, for instance, one family I’m working with, there were four brothers that started a business, and they decided, well, it was actually their dad’s business, but the four took it over, and they decided, We’re all in this together. Like there was no buy, sell, like if one of us wanted to get out, we were selling, you know, and they were, it was all in or all out sort of a situation. Well, now they’re, they’re two generations beyond that, and so looking at the past of Okay, our

46:51
philosophy was this, then, when we were running it, but now our kids and our grandkids are running it.

46:57
Does that philosophy still serve the family? And what ways can we learn from the past and the patterns that we established, and what ways do we need to innovate into the future to make sure that our family our family relationships can can be preserved and the business can be perpetuated? So I love the idea of looking backwards in the rearview mirror, learning, but also then quickly turning towards towards the windshield and looking out and saying, but what do we what do we need now? And I just think, there’s, there’s great there’s great learning there. And again, it’s about that co creation of our future together, not having to do things exactly how our grandparents did it. But it’s that opportunity to say, these are some great things that our grandparents did. These are some learnings. And what do we want for our future together? So that co creation, I think, is important. I like that that looking backwards and looking at some of the good things,

48:04
but then in in turning it and saying, okay, a lot of that stuff was great, but it’s also, you know, that was 50 years ago, a lot of things have changed. What are the good things we can keep and what are the things we need to add to or or do less of or how do we morph this or turn it in a way that serves us better, always with a goal to then have the conversation, to co create something, and that’s a role that we as facilitators, because we are there to serve The family. We’re not part of it. We are uniquely positioned to be able to lead those conversations and and have them look back, where some people will look back fondly, but then to acknowledge, as we’re now looking to the future, that some of the younger people who didn’t live that past part, but might be seeing different ways that it can can change in the future, to just hold that space so that the family can co create new ways forward. And sometimes it’ll happen quickly, sometimes it’ll take a while, but but helping them to have those conversations creates the possibility that as long as we can make sure they’re all hearing each other, that that better, better, a better future can arise, can evolve from from where we were before, as we now shine the flashlight down the road and say, Well, yeah, but Where do we want to go with this? Yeah,

49:42
and yeah, just Dave your example there how important agency is.

49:49
Going back to your comment of, you know, those brothers decided they they wanted one off ramp, you know, their grandkids maybe deserve to make that decision again, to say, how many off ramps do we want here and and the impact of 2000 employees, if they keep that, you know, we’re all in it, or we’re all out, like it’s, you know, that the impact is bigger than just On the family. So absolutely, yeah, the community impact is is massive there. Now I haven’t seen any questions come up. So before we wrap up, I’d love to give each of you a chance to share one final thought. Could be a takeaway piece of advice, a reminder of maybe what you learned or reminded yourself of in in our conversation that our audience can take away with them. After today, Steve, I’ll, I’ll start with you.

50:57
You know I’m, I recognize that people who don’t do this work have trouble conceiving of what it is. I hope we’ve given you a little bit of behind the scenes or what what it really takes to do this work. Well, it is a privilege to be the only non family member in a group of family members. It allows us to, you know, we need to be close enough to the family so that we know what’s going on, but we can never be part of the system, because then we lose the ability to act on the system for the family.

51:40
The work that we do really is challenging, but we don’t have to come up with the solutions for the family. We just have to help them talk about and CO create and learn to communicate with each other better. And so it’s been, it’s been a pleasure exchanging this time with with both of you, because I know you both do this same kind of work, and the conversations that we have amongst other people who do this are always very enriching. And so I hope people watching this will will get something out of it as well, because I think there’s a huge need for families to have people who can play this role for them, and so the number of people who want to do this kind of work continues to grow, and hopefully we’re all helping each other do This work better.

52:38
Thanks, Steve. Dave, over to you,

52:43
Well, I would say, as a family member getting into these sorts of conversations, I would do all you can to assume good intentions of others if we go into conversations, especially if family meetings are new, and if we go in with negative intentions or assumptions that someone’s going to try to take advantage of me, or someone’s going to try to get more or whatever, you know, we have a negative impact on the system. And so I would encourage, I would encourage all to go in deciding and deciding that others are also showing up with good intent and and just making that decision can change the tone of the room. I would also say, go in with curiosity about others and about what the needs are, what the concerns are what the worries are of others. And when we worry and think about others, our concerns oftentimes get solved. But if we’re only thinking about our worries, our concerns, people will feel that. People will feel that,

54:00
you know, kind of that spirit of me versus we. And so I think just, you know, considering how we show up is is a good start to ultimately having a successful interaction.

54:18
A great way to say how important it is

54:26
to love one another. But I heard there Dave without even using the word so that that was marvelous.

54:35
Well, thank you both. I enjoyed this hour with with each of you. It was it was informative, some great takeaways for our audience. I want to thank our audience for joining us, those who tuned in live, those who are grabbing the recording because now it’s the time for them to hear it. And you know, I think you both did such a great job at wrapping us up. I think that curiosity is the number one thing for me when it comes to looking at at patterns and assumptions and how to disrupt them. That’s really what we talked about today. And I want to invite everyone to continue to have these conversations. You know, connect with with Steve, Dave and I on on LinkedIn. The three of us are there and, you know, send us. Send us a message if you have any questions, as I previously mentioned. And you know, there’s, there’s so many ways that I continue to bring this information to the world. So you know, if it be our bi weekly newsletter, where we’re curating insights from from other great people across the industry.

56:07
Our legacy builders podcast, which both Dave and Steve have kindly given their time, and we continue to have amazing guests who gift that that as well, and you can find those on Apple podcast, Spotify YouTube music and stay tuned for our next month webcast. And I look forward to seeing everyone then. So thank you.

56:39
Thank you. Thanks guys. Bye.